Knoxx ban appeal

[Anon10011 37]

In-game name:  General Knoxx
SteamID (https://steamid.io/): STEAM_0:1:40997652
Staff members in-game name: Papa krabbe
Staff members SteamID (https://garnetgaming.net/darkrp/bans) (/id (name):STEAM_0:0:153848304
Date & Time of incident:11/15/2020
Timezone:EST
Ban Reason: MRDM
How long were you banned for?: 2 weeks

What happened? (include any proof): I killed NFA Phil and NFA Maple inside my base, My friend ACE was in the base also that I killed and only got reported twice. Ace's death wasn't RDM ace never made a report on me. 
Why should your ban be removed?: Because this is the first time I've been banned. This should of been a warn x2 and or warn / jail x2 instead it was a sit with NFA Phil ( no punishment was done) and then a second report with NFA Maple ( which I was got banned for 2 weeks)   I have the screen shots of Ghost saying I didn't RDM <<<<< him. Side note( When in the first sit with Phil I was trying to explain to him, when him and Maple ran into my base that I was getting ready to set up printers) the sit with Phil ended and we went on with our nights.

Edited November 15, 2020 by Anon10011

[DiegoZavier 612]

@PapaKrabbe

[Sauce AceFUBAR 41]

35 minutes ago, Anon10011 said:

In-game name:  General Knoxx
SteamID (https://steamid.io/): STEAM_0:1:40997652
Staff members in-game name: Papa krabbe
Staff members SteamID (https://garnetgaming.net/darkrp/bans) (/id (name):STEAM_0:0:153848304
Date & Time of incident:11/15/2020
Timezone:EST
Ban Reason: MRDM
How long were you banned for?: 2 weeks

What happened? (include any proof): I killed NFA Phil and NFA Maple inside my base, My friend ACE was in the base also that I killed and only got reported twice. Ace's death wasn't RDM ace never made a report on me. 
Why should your ban be removed?: Because this is the friend time I've been banned. This should of been a warn x2 and or warn / jail x2 instead it was a sit with NFA Phil ( no punishment was done) and then a second report with NFA Maple ( which I was got banned for 2 weeks)   I have the screen shots of Ghost saying I didn't RDM <<<<< him

He shouldnt even be banned im his friend and he didnt mean to kill me ok..
he was trying to get the people out of his base then he didnt mean to kill me ok un ban him this was prob a miss understanding

[maplesyrup139 8]

consensual RDM is still RDM.

44 minutes ago, Anon10011 said:

Why should your ban be removed?: Because this is the friend time I've been banned.

This is not a valid reason for an unban.

[PapaKrabbe 40]

I want to say right off the bat that there is clearly some kind of problem between the reporter and reportee in this situation before I had even taken the sit, and I find this whole ordeal a bit strange to say the least. I'd also like to point out how it's a bit immature to react with agree and disagrees to a topic or post in that topic without any actual evidence being provided or lack thereof (Y'all really made a mess while I took a few minutes to clip this video)

Besides the strange nature of the reactions in this topic and some very obvious biases (all love to you guys btw) here's the evidence I banned Knoxx for:

https://streamable.com/wljmq8

(Please forgive the horrible resolution and echo in the video, I forgot to switch my audio and video settings on OBS to go with the TV I'm currently using)

The screenshots show that there is no sign, the time of the screenshot and time of deaths were evidently at the same time, within 10 seconds of each.  Knoxx would not have been banned had he not admitted to killing ace for the same reason as Maple and Phil Philly. The video is mainly meant for what he says that incriminates him, and  this is what led me to a ban, even if I thought it was a bit of a cheeky one. I would like to point out that Knoxx did say they were interfering with his building, and so although it was technically RDM, it was not truly for no reason and should in no way negatively affect Knoxx's reputation.

 

Note- This response, although it was a bit wordy and accusational sounding, is neither a condemnation nor a defense of Knoxx's actions, and this is simply the evidence I had gathered to result in a ban. My opinion aside, this is the unbiased cold cut evidence. If there is any clarification needed I have an 11-hour video I can cut more clips from and even make this one longer, just let me know. As of right now though, it is 2:39 AM and I am tired, so any response to questions asked hereon will coming the morning. I wish the best to all involved, so if I said something in this that seemed targeted at you please take no offense. (Please also excuse any typos or grammatical errors, my eyes are half-closed.)

[Anon10011 37]

As I did have no sign up, my intentions were not to Mass RDM, In the video I didn't say Ghost, I was including the 3 NFA people, Jorts, maple, and phil. Ghost is my friend  I have no bad intentions with Phil as I never did at the start. I killed Jorts and Maple from a raid they did prior to this incident, Ghost knows I didn't mean to kill him which is what he replied in the comments. I was building my base to ready for a night of printer farming. When I killed Maple and jorts, I didn't have a sign up in which they still both proceeded to raid me I waited until they started to keypad crack my base in return I killed them.   I tried to explain that ghost didn't care but was waiting to see how papa would handle this situation. Seeing as how Ghost was never involved nor was there a third sit from ghost to be involved.

 

Edited November 15, 2020 by Anon10011

[jorts 121]

1 hour ago, Anon10011 said:

As I did have no sign up, my intentions were not to Mass RDM, In the video I didn't say Ghost, I was including the 3 NFA people, Jorts, maple, and phil. Ghost is my friend  I have no bad intentions with Phil as I never did at the start. I killed Jorts and Maple from a raid they did prior to this incident, Ghost knows I didn't mean to kill him which is what he replied in the comments. I was building my base to ready for a night of printer farming. When I killed Maple and jorts, I didn't have a sign up in which they still both proceeded to raid me I waited until they started to keypad crack my base in return I killed them.   I tried to explain that ghost didn't care but was waiting to see how papa would handle this situation. Seeing as how Ghost was never involved nor was there a third sit from ghost to be involved.

 

since i was mentioned here; this was an entirely different point in time then when we raided. i'm not involved in this scenario at all.

Edited November 15, 2020 by jorts

[DiegoZavier 612]

@PapaKrabbe Can you specify for which kills you banned him for mass? 

[PapaKrabbe 40]

In the video, to take a quote from 0:14 and on " You, ghost and... the other friend... that's why I killed all three of you"

He was banned for killing Maple (you), Ace(ghost), and Phil Philly (the other friend)

In the screenshot of kill logs I provided you can see ace died at around the same time as the other two (within 6 seconds) and this video has him saying he killed them all for that same reason. Even if Ace was okay with it, no matter how frustrated Knoxx was with him, this still would have been rdm as there was no sign. If he had killed any of them thinking he had put a sign up, I would have shortened this to a week ban for unintentional mass, but in his most recent reply to the topic he seems to make it clear he was aware of the absence of a sign.

[Anon10011 37]

I have made it clear about my sign because I was working on the base for about 20-40minutes in which as I stated was getting ready to printer farm, if ghost had made a report then I would understand for this punishment, it wouldn't make sense seeing as how ghost is my friend. Why didn't I get warned and or jailed for the first sit, ghost knew I killed him by mistake just because 2 other people ( not ment to be in my base )  aside from ghost who was supposed to be in my base can make the report and get me banned? Espically when in the first sit no punishment had happened.

The reason I was upset with ghost is because I killed him by mistake trying to get 2 people out of my base while setting it up. There is no more friendly fire so I don't see how this works. 

 

If it was the case of MRDM it would of been brought up during the first sit as you saw Phil and I left on a good note when the sit left until mintues later someone else ( who wasn't supposed to be in my base ) made a report and was insteantly accepted as a 2 week ban.

This is the same as if a party setting of friend fire was off and you shot your teamate by mistake.        It would come down to the opinion of the staff doing the sit, situation that brought the sit there in the first place, and the intent to mass rdm in general ( as I don't remeber even having a warn on currently )    This was all done inside my base, with no punishment other then a 2 week ban as the goto thing. 

Edited November 15, 2020 by Anon10011

[maplesyrup139 8]

1 hour ago, Anon10011 said:

I have made it clear about my sign because I was working on the base for about 20-40minutes in which as I stated was getting ready to printer farm, if ghost had made a report then I would understand for this punishment, it wouldn't make sense seeing as how ghost is my friend. Why didn't I get warned and or jailed for the first sit, ghost knew I killed him by mistake just because 2 other people ( not ment to be in my base )  aside from ghost who was supposed to be in my base can make the report and get me banned? Espically when in the first sit no punishment had happened.

The reason I was upset with ghost is because I killed him by mistake trying to get 2 people out of my base while setting it up. There is no more friendly fire so I don't see how this works. 

 

If it was the case of MRDM it would of been brought up during the first sit as you saw Phil and I left on a good note when the sit left until mintues later someone else ( who wasn't supposed to be in my base ) made a report and was insteantly accepted as a 2 week ban.

This is the same as if a party setting of friend fire was off and you shot your teamate by mistake.        It would come down to the opinion of the staff doing the sit, situation that brought the sit there in the first place, and the intent to mass rdm in general ( as I don't remeber even having a warn on currently )    This was all done inside my base, with no punishment other then a 2 week ban as the goto thing. 

in the first sit krabbe did not have the proof to show that what happened was RDM, when he took my sit later i showed him proof of times.

[Anon10011 37]

If all that had to be done was take screen shots of my base and make a choice then papa could have done so the first time when I was reported, all the rest is in logs.                 

MRDM is intent to kill 3 people the 2 that were in my base when I was trying to get my base going, were the ones I was trying to get out after telling then multipul of times to leave.   

 Which is what I explained to papa and Phil during the first sit 

[PapaKrabbe 40]

While MRDM is actually the act of killing 3 people or one person twice and another once, etc. , if Ace's death was unintentional (Which was not at all said in during the sit or in the clip I provided by the way) then the ban should be lowered to a 1 week for unintentional MRDM. I'd like to clarify again though, this was never said to ke during the sit and Knoxx said he was "Upset with" Ace multiple times, causing me to assume his death was intentional, and since it was stated in this clip all the players killed were killed for the same reason.

[Anon10011 37]

This doesn't make Any sense, I have the proof of when this happen of ghost saying he didn't care of the mistaken RDM, that he knew I didn't mean to, and that he's also my friend.

So then it goes back to what I was saying in the begining, how is this fair when there is not a system for me to have my friends ( that want to base with me ) put on friendly fire for me ( or Anyone because this can happen to anyone in general on the server as of current, any person, minger/etc can get away with a report like this because there is no system in place to stop the " rdm/MRDM.  Killing friends inside of there own base when the same thing happens ) meaning there's no way for me to not be able to not kill any of my friends in my base by mistake which doesn't seem fair, as what happened when I mistakenly killed ghost.

This wouldn't have even happen in the first place. No ban.    Just a warn and jail also seeing as how nothing happened in the first sit, it would of have had to been up to the staff taking the sits opinion of the situation that took place to bring the sit to a roof because then it would of been only 2 deaths.   There is no system on the server to help that cause. Meaning anyone on the server can report for the same thing and get different punishments then what I received. 

[PapaKrabbe 40]

This the last time I'm going to re-clarify what happened. Knoxx was reported for RDM by both Maple and Phil. Phil's proof was not enough, as a screenshot of a base with no sign minutes after a death is not proof of an RDM. This is because the sign could have been accidentally deleted, taken by a minge, and so on. the screenshot and picture of the time however matches up with the deaths. The story has changed multiple times in this thread and from the sit, where it was originally said (In video) that Knoxx killed all three of them because they were interfering for his building (Not a valid reason to kill without a KOS sign) "that's why I killed all three of you" as he said in the video I provided. It seems there's a bit of a misunderstanding  on how a Mass RDM ban works, so I'll explain a bit: There does not need to be three reports on you for you to be banned for mass, nor do you need to have the intent to mass. This would make no sense, as a player could MRDM and then if only one player reported them, they would get off with a single RDM punishment. I do not take kindly to the suddenly new information that Knoxx was basing with Ace, as this directly contradicts what was said in the clip I provided where, once again, he said he killed Ace for interfering with his building and not by accident, and whether Ace minded or not, players and staff both have been banned for consensual RDM, and it should be no different here.

The issue of the party system is very true, as this could cause plenty of accidental RDMs (which should be dismissed) but I simply cannot believe with the evidence from my post and what I heard in the sit that Ace's death was accidental. To add to this point, if his death was accidental, I as the staff member made the decision to consider the RDM as RDM since I had no knowledge of the nature of the death. Accidental RDM, however unfair some may consider it, is still considered RDM, and with the two others the best I could see here is a reduced ban to 1 week, although an accidental kill seems like a convenient new story.

This is as clear as I can make this topic, and anything else I say will just be my opinion and therefore irrelevant. This is the evidence I have gathered, and this