[MRP] Reserves Removal

[James_R_Tanner 3]

Admin abuse is defined as the instance in which a person with administrative powers uses them in such a way that has negative consequences on the game that is being played and the players that are playing the game. 

personally i think that 1. implementing a change that's only purpose is to essentially say "hey ya know all that work you put into your faction/server then went on reserves because you can't play as much any more or you put too many hours into a game and need a break well that's too bad keep playing or louse your rank and have to start all over again" 2. for people who are known to come off reserves and help save a faction from dying that is now almost impossible because  they would have to wait the month+ to get up to 2LT and make any real difference  by that time its bit too late and the faction will likely be dead. 3. when the majority of the player base (that i have talked to) strongly disagree with this change but instead of listening to your players you strong arm this joke of a rule into effect and post the notice at 3am to avoid the community backlash i would define this as a prime example of admin abuse. 

[James_R_Tanner 3]

14 minutes ago, AwesomeAidan said:

I will assist any faction i can and make sure that every faction has the right people in it to help fix it, not the wrong

because staff taking control of factions has always ended well

 

[Ting 368]

18 minutes ago, James_R_Tanner said:

i would define this as a prime example of admin abuse.

tell me. how is it admin abuse when aidan is the one who defines admin abuse

[James_R_Tanner 3]

2 minutes ago, Ting said:

tell me. how is it admin abuse when aidan is the one who defines admin abuse

i used the most common definition of admin abuse 

 

[PrisonNightmare 741]

21 minutes ago, AwesomeAidan said:

But in the past month I have seen and dealt with countless problems and issues brought up by reserves even before we had implemented the guidelines. Of course, not everyone is able to see these issues themselves as they are brought to the executive team and not the community. A month ago I would have laughed at a reserves wipe, now I see that reserves have been the source of a lot of problems, toxicity, and privileged.

 

This post makes literally no sense. You are essentially generalizing the reserve system because of some bad cases, and are now punishing the whole system while not even giving it a chance to be revised or reworked. It is literally your job to handle and punish the people who abuse the system, I don't see why you're just removing it completely instead of doing what you have been doing previously and just continue removing the abusers or reworking the system so those cases are less likely to occur. See this:

 

7 hours ago, PrisonNightmare said:

This is how I'd rework the current reserves system: Do not allow anyone that is in an active faction to have reserves on any other faction. Only allow people who have consistently dedicated their time to one faction the ability to have reserves on said faction. Allow them to play with the reserves rank, but if they choose to return active within the community again then the reserves will be removed. Essentially the person would only be able to retain one reserves spot in one faction, and can not have reserves in multiple factions.

 

You guys keep saying that it has been the source of a lot of problems, but when you say that without giving me any sort of elaboration on it, it just makes me confused . You guys just went straight to jumping the gun and removing the reserves system before even trying to revise the reserves (Apart from the updated reserves guidelines, which had multiple problems in of itself). How did the new reserves guidelines not work when it came to limiting reserve powers/abuse? Could you not have tried even a little harder to revise it further? Sorry if I seem toxic, but I just feel like I've been getting a lot of bullshit answers from both you and Garnet.

 

[Lex_ 506]

50 minutes ago, AwesomeAidan said:

I thought reserves were a right, not a privileged.

People aren't arguing against why the team felt it was necessary to remove reserves as a whole. Most, if not all, of the responses to this thread that are against the removal of reserves address the issues surrounding how reserves previously worked. So the argument is that removing reserves is not the right call and would be an extreme solution to the problem (and to be plain honest: this community has a repeating theme of going in directions that may be harmful down the line when faced with a serious problem).

The guidelines were definitely something that needed to be put into place. The community has proven untrustworthy in handling reserves and that makes it entirely fair that some sort of staff intervention needs to be taken (ie. creating a set of rules and requirements that need to be met to be given/give reserves).

The real problem isn't even the idea of reserves. It's the individual community members who abused such a thing, be it by handing out reserves or by abusing their reserves in some way. Punishing the people who aren't abusing their reserves or who have legitimately earned it (I know, throwing this around like we have a clear definition of what "earning" your title on a Gmod server actually looks like) just isn't the way to go.

1 hour ago, Tayler said:

Make it so reserved players can't come off reserves until a  solid 2 weeks+ of activity on the server.

Prior to reserves being removed, this was the case. The only issue was the language used for that specific rule. In some interpretations people would become active duty and had the required 2 weeks to their existing rank cooldown. In others they would wait the required 2 weeks before becoming active duty. Neither one was specifically enforced over the other and there are plenty of cases where both were allowed. At minimum, officer reserves would have to wait 3 weeks to be promoted to O-2.

 

In the end I feel that the guidelines that were being used before this final decision were enough to combat the issues with reserves. Staff need to be more involved with the factions on the server - the freedom that leaders get provides pros and cons, but at some point it needs to be balanced properly.

Edited April 24, 2020 by Torch
Spelling be op

[Fupert1 231]

47 minutes ago, James_R_Tanner said:

2. for people who are known to come off reserves and help save a faction from dying that is now almost impossible because  they would have to wait the month+ to get up to 2LT and make any real difference  by that time its bit too late and the faction will likely be dead.

49 minutes ago, AwesomeAidan said:

If a faction leader comes and speaks to me saying they need help and suggests putting the right people in the faction to help it, i am not going to deny them that.

You didn't even bother reading Aidan's latest post. Reserves are rarely used anymore for factions that are actually dying.

 

47 minutes ago, James_R_Tanner said:

Admin abuse is defined as the instance in which a person with administrative powers uses them in such a way that has negative consequences on the game that is being played and the players that are playing the game. 

Admin abuse is going over your reach/what you're allowed to do. If you payed any attention to MRP you'd know Aidan is allowed to do this, and if you payed any attention to this post you'd see that Garnet is supporting it.

 

You probably just got tagged in the army discord saying that your reserves are getting removed so you came on to complain about it.

Edited April 24, 2020 by Fupert1

[James_R_Tanner 3]

 

19 minutes ago, Fupert1 said:

You probably just got tagged in the army discord saying that your reserves are getting removed so you came on to complain about it.

my personal reserves where a formality i made it vary clear to everyone that this would be the last time i was coming back 

 

 

21 minutes ago, Fupert1 said:

You didn't even bother reading Aidan's latest post. Reserves are rarely used anyone for factions that are actually dying.

 i started typing my first response before the post was out also i guess the all time myself and multiple others came off reserves to save army from dying never happened most resent was only 2-3 months ago 

 

 

24 minutes ago, Fupert1 said:

Admin abuse is going over your reach/what you're allowed to do. If you payed any attention to MRP you'd know Aidan is allowed to do this, and if you payed any attention to this post you'd see that Garnet is supporting it.

i'm not saying he is going over his reach i'm saying that this will have a negative impact on the player base 

[Ziggy 1,353]

5 minutes ago, James_R_Tanner said:

that this would be the last time

Nigga stop relapsing MRP and either resign or find the time to play. Instead of posting on here trying to save your year old reserve rank, you could actually be working towards an earned rank. 

6 minutes ago, James_R_Tanner said:

i'm not saying he is going over his reach i'm saying that this will have a negative impact on the player base 

No, it will have a very fair and positive impact long term. The only people that have a problem with this will be short term, as soon enough, all the niggas complaining on here will either find time or finally leave. 
 

I don’t get why anyone needs a reserve rank. If you put so much “time and effort” into a faction then you should be able to leave it behind you with a confidence that whoever  you put in charge will do a good job. Instead, they assign someone who they know will keep their free Officer spot on the docs, then they leave for months and come back when they’re bored and immediately have an upper hand over newer players. 
 

Or in your case, as Fupert said, come back when they’re pinged on discord to save their rank. 

[James_R_Tanner 3]

 

9 minutes ago, Bishopil said:

No, it will have a very fair and positive impact long term. The only people that have a problem with this will be short term, as soon enough, all the niggas complaining on here will either find time or finally leave. 
 

well having been around longer then reserves have i always believed they helped more than they hindered, however how do you know for a fact that they will have a positive impact? 

 

 

10 minutes ago, Bishopil said:

Or in your case, as Fupert said, come back when they’re pinged on discord to save their rank. 

i'm only here to give my opinion like most of the other people here but as i stated before my reserves where a formality everyone knows that i am not coming back 

 

 

12 minutes ago, Bishopil said:

Nigga stop relapsing MRP and either resign or find the time to play. Instead of posting on here trying to save your year old reserve rank, you could actually be working towards an earned rank. 

well i earned  Multiple general slots but that doesn't count does it ,  to reiterate i resigned permanently from the server on 2/20/2020 

[Lex_ 506]

Just now, James_R_Tanner said:

i resigned permanently from the server on 2/20/2020 

Saying you resigned permanently implies that you don't intend to return to the server. If you have no intention to return to the server, then there is no reason for you to have reserves.

I originally disagreed with the decision to remove reserves. I've thought about it more and I agree. I think that this could have been dealt with better by giving the community a heads up and hearing out those who are opposed, rather than jumping to the toxic response of "wah wah" like @Bishopil essentially did (although he really isn't wrong) and doing it without full community discussion.

[DuckyRU 403]

not good idea

[Kendal 450]

The arguments against this new policy seem really self-serving, as most arguments are when it comes to MRP players hating a staff made decision these days. 

It's a lot of "I didn't do X so my reserves for X shouldn't be taken!" or my personal favorite "If someone led a fact-" fucking okay man. A lot of people lead factions. And they are passed around from leader to the next like corona man. Do you want to keep playing the faction you are in? Okay, then keep playing it. I myself had reserves in GRU, PDSS, and GB. I only played the server for like 6 or so months. That doesn't even count the factions that I joined which required me to go on reserves in those factions anyways. 

Do I care about my reserves being taken? Of course not. Especially if staff deems my use of them as abuse in some way. 
A.) I don't play the server anymore

B.) I was given reserves in factions I myself don't think I necessarily earned them for.

C.) The reserves system is not meant for people who are leaving a faction for another, they are meant for people who are not able to play the server. Once they come back they can continue progress in THAT faction. It's really frustrating that something that easy to read and comprehend seems to be so controversial. Your whatever fucking faction reserves were always meant to be used in that way, not for you to hop around.

@Torch rather than jumping to the toxic response of "wah wah" like @Bishopil essentially did (although he really isn't wrong)

So if he isn't wrong... then why call out his "really isn't wrong" response? Huh???

@James_R_Tanner i would define this as a prime example of admin abuse. 

It's good that you didn't create the term, nor definition then.

@Dexx You're telling me if a leader spends 1 year devoted to the faction, he leaves the server for a short amount of time and he comes back and shouldn't get reserves back?

Yes, and it's a good thing that you haven't led a faction then. Otherwise you'd probably actually be mad instead of jumping on the hate staff trend huh?

@Cold Soldier With all due respect, this is just a flat-out retarded decision.

@VBSA I think removing the reserves completely is one of the worst things that can be done.

No, the server shutting down entirely would be the one of the worst things that can be done. Stripping reserves from people that shouldn't have them falls in the same category as scolding a kid that thinks they know better than the parent. In other words, necessary.

@VBSA As an old marshal, I can say that if I did not have reserves, it would be impossible to keep 2GA alive when I first came.
What do you expect people to do?

They expect, that people who want to play the server again come back and rise through the ranks to prove they are still dedicated enough to help. Same thing goes for those who argue "But I still help with tryouts!"

@VBSA Leaving that decision up to Marshal is just "common sense".

Didn't you give the current marshal your rank? This, in your words is "one of the worst things that can be done". This is the kind of shit that breeds favoritism. The next marshal purges all the people he doesn't know, in favor for all of his incompetent friends getting reserves over people that might have actually done some good. Honestly, I wouldn't boast about your marshallship or use it as a platform to try and stress how oppressing a matter this new policy is. Your officer line-up was full of either inactives, or complete morons. Most of which probably would have gotten reserves from you had they left, despite how incompetent they were. "Common sense" is removing the disease from the body, not letting it spread to others or further destroying you.

Sorry, not sorry for the toxicity. But there's a lot of baby wah-wah recently and I'm fucking sick of it. 

I'm glad staff are taking the necessary steps to fix this broken fucking system. If you want to keep your rank in a faction stay in that faction man.

Edited April 24, 2020 by Kendal

[Dexx 395]

59 minutes ago, Kendal said:

You're telling me if a leader spends 1 year devoted to the faction, he leaves the server for a short amount of time and he comes back and shouldn't get reserves back?

Yes, and it's a good thing that you haven't led a faction then. Otherwise you'd probably actually be mad instead of jumping on the hate staff trend huh?

You are so fixated on this thing of me hating staff, and you haven't spoken to me of recently I guess you have your own opinion on me. Anyways, you missed the part when I said reserves just need to be rework. If the player devotes time and energy to the server leaves because he gets burnt out, then a couple of months decides to come back onto the server in the same faction he has to restart? His progression will already be lost, and he may just choose to disband the server completely. Reserves are for respectable players that dedicated time and energy for the faction that left for a reason, and you'll know that will play the faction again. Keeps players that are on reserves coming back and holds MRP population up at least when comes to returning players.

Edited April 24, 2020 by Dexx

[VBSA 106]

2 hours ago, Jackal said:

Reserves shouldn't be keeping factions alive. Especially in the case of base factions. If you are incapable of being active alongside your officers then you just resign cause you end up hurting the faction and indirectly you did the same intentional or not. Also, lets assume you never had officers and it was just you it is still manageable relying on reserves shows how incompetent of a leader you truly are since you can't rely on yourself as well as your intuition.

At first, I could not understand what body part you were using while reading what I wrote, but you have drawn the subject to quite ridiculous places.
It may be easy for you to fill your friends into a faction, but in some cases when the management changes, the new leader may not have anything left. Something similiar happened in my case. So, it is nothing but nonsense to approach the incident as "If you are starting to rely on reserves it must have been your fault, so resignation is the best option". Sometimes you have to rely on reserves (its not the best way to do it im aware)

develop some empathy skills.

Edited April 24, 2020 by VBSA2