WohMi - Ban Appeal

[WohMi 182]

In-game name: WohMi
SteamID (https://steamid.io/): STEAM_0:1:212219498
Staff members in-game name: 1800 nick
Staff members SteamID (https://garnetgaming.net/darkrp/bans) (/id (name): (STEAM_0:0:102789387
Date & Time of incident: 2022-08-16 - 23:50:22
Timezone: CST
Ban Reason: "Unintendional RDA (saying you're manipulating staff, fr?)
How long were you banned for?: 1 week
Proof of Ban: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2850139042
What happened? (include any proof): Was playing Cop, there was weapon/raidtool aos laws. I arrested people based on those laws. Got pulled into a sit, where someone said i arrested them when they had a physgun out (not true lma)
Why should your ban be removed?: The reporter had ZERO evidence. NONE.  I didn't break any rules, the only thing that Nick had to go on was a Level 7 saying he had his Physgun out. Nick definitely needs a retraining if he's taking bans without any evidence like this.

Edited August 17, 2022 by WohMi
a BAN appeal

[voidz 20]

1. It wasn't my sit, I was helping Qualcon with one of his sits.

2. You had no reason to go into his base, you arrested him for having a gun out and it had no proof along with it about printers and such inside his base but you went in anyway

3. You were saying 15 people in a short time span all had their guns out just sitting in the street. Log screenshot attached.

Several reports came in complaining about you randomly arresting people as well. I put it in as unintentional because I couldn't gage whether it was unintentional or malicious. I banned you with no doubt in my mind that these people were mostly or partially randomly arrested. Qualcon had agreed with me that this looked like a Random Arrest case so we took it as such.

Edited August 17, 2022 by voidz

[WohMi 182]

9 minutes ago, voidz said:

I banned you with no doubt in my mind that these people were mostly or partially randomly arrested. Qualcon had agreed with me that this looked like a Random Arrest case so we took it as such.

Cool. There was a law that said weapons and raidtools are AOS. Unless you have actual proof of me RDAing, this is a false ban.

I will be saving that screenshot, btw. Look at them numbers! I'm such a good cop.

1. It wasn't my sit, I was helping Qualcon with one of his sits.

You were the one who banned me, and I did not see this Qualcon person anywhere during the sit.

2. You had no reason to go into his base, you arrested him for having a gun out and it had no proof along with it about printers and such inside his base but you went in anyway

I wasn't in his base, and he did have a gun out. You're supposed to ask for proof from the reporter, not the reported. I didn't even warrant him for printers. I wanted him for having a gun out.

3. You were saying 15 people in a short time span all had their guns out just sitting in the street. Log screenshot attached.

Yea. They did. Weapons/Raidtools = AOS get people ALL the time.

Edited August 17, 2022 by WohMi
cant quote, so editing

[voidz 20]

5 minutes ago, WohMi said:

Cool. There was a law that said weapons and raidtools are AOS. Unless you have actual proof of me RDAing, this is a false ban.

I will be saving that screenshot, btw. Look at them numbers! I'm such a good cop.

Every single time you were brought to a sit, they had said they didn't have a gun out and 15 people out of the 50 on the server at the time is very unlikely to be in the street in one place where you can get them all at the same time.

By the way, Qualcon will be coming in here and providing a video of the sit to show exactly what I was talking about with the base.

But the fact you arrested 15 people in that short of a time span meant 15 people all would've had to have been in the same place, in the middle of the street with their guns out. Very, incredibly unlikely on this server.

If it was the case where the law was JUST added seconds ago, then you should give them a chance to put them away (since i know that was one of your talking points)

8 minutes ago, WohMi said:

Cool. There was a law that said weapons and raidtools are AOS. Unless you have actual proof of me RDAing, this is a false ban.

I will be saving that screenshot, btw. Look at them numbers! I'm such a good cop.

1. It wasn't my sit, I was helping Qualcon with one of his sits.

You were the one who banned me, and I did not see this Qualcon person anywhere during the sit.

2. You had no reason to go into his base, you arrested him for having a gun out and it had no proof along with it about printers and such inside his base but you went in anyway

I wasn't in his base, and he did have a gun out. You're supposed to ask for proof from the reporter, not the reported. I didn't even warrant him for printers. I wanted him for having a gun out.

3. You were saying 15 people in a short time span all had their guns out just sitting in the street. Log screenshot attached.

Yea. They did. Weapons/Raidtools = AOS get people ALL the time.

I mixed up sits, yeah this was a different sit, my fault.

Also if you can just provide proof that they all had guns out or a screenshot of all of them with guns out, you should provide that.

Edited August 17, 2022 by voidz

[WohMi 182]

34 minutes ago, voidz said:

Every single time you were brought to a sit, they had said they didn't have a gun out

So, all of two times? With the first person who reported me being banned for "Homophobia" and RDMing me in a sit?

34 minutes ago, voidz said:

Butt the fact you arrested 15 people in that short of a time span meant 15 people all would've had to have been in the same place, in the middle of the street with their guns out. Very, incredibly unlikely on this server.

If you look at your OWN screenshot, this was not a short timespan of arrests. this was between 12:23 and 12:45. So, 22 minutes.

34 minutes ago, voidz said:

If it was the case where the law was JUST added seconds ago, then you should give them a chance to put them away (since i know that was one of your talking points)

It wasn't. The mayor at the time had the law up when I got on the server, and it was those laws up until a little after you pulled me into the sit.

34 minutes ago, voidz said:

Also if you can just provide proof that they all had guns out or a screenshot of all of them with guns out, you should provide that.

This is not how RDA reports work. The reporter has to prove that they were not breaking a law at the time. If I had to take a screenshot every time I arrested someone, I would never, ever play PD.

34 minutes ago, voidz said:

By the way, Qualcon will be coming in here and providing a video of the sit to show exactly what I was talking about with the base.

I mixed up sits, yeah this was a different sit, my fault.

So if Qualcon wasn't involved in this sit, then why is he providing a video of the sit that he wasn't in?

Edited August 17, 2022 by WohMi
accidentally included the same point twice. my bad.

[voidz 20]

Just now, WohMi said:

So, all of two times? With the first person who reported me being banned for "Homophobia" and RDMing me in a sit?

If you look at your OWN screenshot, this was not a short timespan of arrests. this was between 12:23 and 12:45. So, 22 minutes.

 

If you look at your OWN screenshot, this was not a short timespan of arrests. this was between 12:23 and 12:45. So, 22 minutes.

It wasn't. The mayor at the time had the law up when I got on the server, and it was those laws up until a little after you pulled me into the sit.

This is not how RDA reports work. The reporter has to prove that they were not breaking a law at the time. If I had to take a screenshot every time I arrested someone, I would never, ever play PD.

So if Qualcon wasn't involved in this sit, then why is he providing a video of the sit that he wasn't in?

1. I know how sits work

2. He isn't providing a video, I got mixed up in a different sit and thought it was you

[TheDudeAbidesV2 51]

5 hours ago, voidz said:

1. It wasn't my sit, I was helping Qualcon with one of his sits.

2. You had no reason to go into his base, you arrested him for having a gun out and it had no proof along with it about printers and such inside his base but you went in anyway

3. You were saying 15 people in a short time span all had their guns out just sitting in the street. Log screenshot attached.

Several reports came in complaining about you randomly arresting people as well. I put it in as unintentional because I couldn't gage whether it was unintentional or malicious. I banned you with no doubt in my mind that these people were mostly or partially randomly arrested. Qualcon had agreed with me that this looked like a Random Arrest case so we took it as such.

You say short time span but this is over the course of around 20 min. Entirely possible for that to happen since people very regularly have weapons and raid tools are out. It's not that unlikely lol, especially in a 20 min span. He also doesn't need to provide evidence as that's up to the job of the ones reporting him.

Edited August 17, 2022 by TheDudeAbidesV2

[Korn 253]

I use to be a cop all the time, with this law i’ve legally arrested probably more than that. People just get mad when someone finally becomes a cop and arrests them for valid reasons. I feel these people were just reporting because they want to be free from jail. Zero evidence, I feel WohMi is in the right here.

[ChrisRid 900]

Accepted

I have carefully reviewed the evidence provided in this appeal. Given that there were a number of conflicts in opinion between the reporter and the reportee, further evidence would be required in order to substantiate the reporters claims of false arrest, specifically whether or not the reporter had a weapon or a raid tool out, the location of the arrest, and the number of other false arrests.

During a report, the burden of proof falls on the reporter (with two exceptions below) and as such the reporter must provide evidence to substantiate their claims of a false arrest with the reportee assumed innocent until either they admit that they had indeed falsely arrested people, or if there is evidence proving otherwise. The screenshot of the police log proves that the arrests took place, but it doesn't prove whether or not they were valid. It is entirely possible that all of the arrests made during the 22 minute time frame were legitimate, and there is no evidence to suggest that any of these arrests were false.

[Source - Staff Training Document Tips & Tricks]

You will be unbanned, and I would like to apologise on behalf of the staff team for any inconvenience that this has caused you.
Voidz will be spoken to in order to ensure he has a good understanding of what kind of evidence may be used in a similar situation moving forwards.

@Shin_Tsukimi @stretchy @Glorbnob @FlameSoul @GrosCave
Please lock and move.

Edited August 17, 2022 by ChrisRid