Pencil - Warn Appeal

[Pencil 767]

In-game name: pencil
SteamID (https://steamid.io/): STEAM_0:1:32512533
Staff members in-game name: DickSimmons
Staff members SteamID (/id (name): STEAM_0:0:78126445
Date & Time of incident: 
Timezone: EST
Warn Reason: NLR
What happened? (include any proof): The reporter (forgot name) killed me within a base close to my party's base because he was raiding. I come back to the area to MY base, both to watch and to discuss with the party leader what we want to make with the base. I was not interfering with the raid by any means, I had not instigated any retaliation to the raider, yet he turned around and sniped me while I was on my base wall looking for the right prop to spawn. About 5 minutes later I get pulled to a sit for NLR. 
Why should your warn be removed?: The reportee attempts to get me warned for Mass NLR, Dick then checks logs and only says that there were TWO kills. Warn gets shifted down to NLRx2 for some reason? The two kills would imply that I broke NLR once since I died one time then again. I explain this, warn gets bumped down to NLRx1 without any evidence provided by the reporter for actually being within the area/interfering with his raid. I even explained that I was within my base at the time and at that point the reporter was just spamming to warn and go, I get warned, jailed and now here I am.

[proggy 3,818]

@DickSimmons 

[Berry3 12]

lol it was me who reported you, first off that base close to the base i was raiding was a mega base, connected to yours, you also dont have enough proof for the warn to be removed so. Also the warn was not down to x2 was only moved down to 1 and jail time of 1...

 

-1

Edited November 3, 2019 by Berry3
adding things

[DarkAlias 154]

30 minutes ago, Berry3 said:

lol it was me who reported you, first off that base close to the base i was raiding was a mega base, connected to yours, you also dont have enough proof for the warn to be removed so. Also the warn was not down to x2 was only moved down to 1 and jail time of 1...

 

-1

Well if there wasn't enough proof to prove your case, then he shouldn't need proof to get it removed.

[Ziggy 1,353]

35 minutes ago, Berry3 said:

lol it was me who reported you, first off that base close to the base i was raiding was a mega base, connected to yours, you also dont have enough proof for the warn to be removed so. Also the warn was not down to x2 was only moved down to 1 and jail time of 1...

 

-1

You just contradicted yourself. 

 

5 minutes ago, DarkAlias said:

Well if there wasn't enough proof to prove your case, then he shouldn't need proof to get it removed.

Exactly^ 

You can’t say “he doesn’t have enough proof to prove that he didn’t do it”, because in every case the person who reports needs to have the validation for a warn. 

 

+1 

I was there when it had happened because it was my base too and I had died. I got into a similar sit where Berry had reported me for breaking NLR, but there was no actual evidence so the staff properly dismissed the case.

[GreasyDan 75]

+1 free pencil

[Austin 294]

+1 for obvious reasons stated by bishop and alias

[proggy 3,818]

Just want to point out that Berry is the reporter and doesn't need to have the proof for the punishment, the staff who gave punishment does. You guys should wait on @DickSimmons input.

[Ziggy 1,353]

51 minutes ago, proggy said:

Just want to point out that Berry is the reporter and doesn't need to have the proof for the punishment, the staff who gave punishment does. You guys should wait on @DickSimmons input.

If you make a report, you need to have proof to accuse someone of breaking the rules. The reporter never provided the proof, therefore pencil was warned falsely. The staff and the reporter are both at fault here, but again, this isn’t a report. This is an appeal. 

[proggy 3,818]

13 minutes ago, Bishopil said:

If you make a report, you need to have proof to accuse someone of breaking the rules. The reporter never provided the proof, therefore pencil was warned falsely. The staff and the reporter are both at fault here, but again, this isn’t a report. This is an appeal. 

Not true because sometimes the reporter knows something happened without proof, and the staff can get proof through logs. It isnt the reporters responsibility to have proof for a report, its the staffs responsibility to have proof for a punishment.

[Kicks 254]

15 minutes ago, Bishopil said:

If you make a report, you need to have proof to accuse someone of breaking the rules. The reporter never provided the proof, therefore pencil was warned falsely. The staff and the reporter are both at fault here, but again, this isn’t a report. This is an appeal. 

The staff has to provide the reporter's evidence because if not, the staff made a decision without evidence/proof. Neutral until Dick responds.

 

Edited November 3, 2019 by Kicks

[Ziggy 1,353]

12 minutes ago, Kicks said:

The staff has to provide the reporter's evidence because if not, the staff made a decision without evidence/proof. Neutral until Dick responds.

 

 

12 minutes ago, proggy said:

Not true because sometimes the reporter knows something happened without proof, and the staff can get proof through logs. It isnt the reporters responsibility to have proof for a report, its the staffs responsibility to have proof for a punishment.

Too bad you can’t get logs for “distance away from base”. 

[DickSimmons 4]

Okay, so I just looked through every screenshot I had of yesterday and I cannot find a single one from that sit. so obviously I'm gonna have to +1 this, that's my bad and I'm still semi new to staffing on larger servers where I'm basically required to screenshot every sit for cases like this, I'll work on it.  Logs show that he was killed twice so I warned him and the dude also wanted him jailed. I said NLR x2 because he had killed himself and I had read that as another death on his part by accident (he was never warned for nlr x2 I just misread/misspoke). Reading everybody above's reply I'm split. I've heard so many different things from so many people that I don't even know who's word to trust most of the time. I have had staff higher up than me tell me multiple different things before, ie; unless they have proof don't warn them/ Go off of what logs say, and if it shows them getting killed warn them. After reading what Dark said I guess in cases that have to do with rdm/nlr I will require some sort of proof otherwise I'll just dismiss the case. 

Sorry for messing up again 

 

+1

[Kicks 254]

14 minutes ago, Bishopil said:

 

Too bad you can’t get logs for “distance away from base”. 

Chill.

Just now, DickSimmons said:

Okay, so I just looked through every screenshot I had of yesterday and I cannot find a single one from that sit. so obviously I'm gonna have to +1 this, that's my bad and I'm still semi new to staffing on larger servers where I'm basically required to screenshot every sit for cases like this, I'll work on it.  Logs show that he was killed twice so I warned him and the dude also wanted him jailed. I said NLR x2 because he had killed himself and I had read that as another death on his part by accident (he was never warned for nlr x2 I just misread/misspoke). Reading everybody above's reply I'm split. I've heard so many different things from so many people that I don't even know who's word to trust most of the time. I have had staff higher up than me tell me multiple different things before, ie; unless they have proof don't warn them/ Go off of what logs say, and if it shows them getting killed warn them. After reading what Dark said I guess in cases that have to do with rdm/nlr I will require some sort of proof otherwise I'll just dismiss the case. 

Sorry for messing up again 

 

+1

@DarkAlias

[proggy 3,818]

46 minutes ago, DickSimmons said:

Okay, so I just looked through every screenshot I had of yesterday and I cannot find a single one from that sit. so obviously I'm gonna have to +1 this, that's my bad and I'm still semi new to staffing on larger servers where I'm basically required to screenshot every sit for cases like this, I'll work on it.  Logs show that he was killed twice so I warned him and the dude also wanted him jailed.

In the future make sure to just screenshot logs that you used to make your determination at the very least. Any proof you could gather from the reporters side that isnt logs is really helpful for NLR sits. I really wish our system gave coordinates for Death and Damage locations, but I know that's a lot to ask for. Do not warn or ban without having proof that could cover you if they appeal. Even if you 100% know they did something punishable, you need to have the proof in case they appeal. You can ask higher ups for help if you are confused if there's enough proof for a punishment or not. A lot of times if its too much of a gray area you will just have to get the report resolved without punishment, if the reporter is mad about it you just need to tell them how they can get better proof for themselves next time by screenshotting bodies or something.