One last attempt for MilitaryRP

[Nutter 15,194]

Hello NutGamers™

Please don't mistake this for a thread where you can bash on other players/staff members, I'm simply making this in order to see if some silent people would be willing to be useful and reach out as far as what they would like out of the server. I'll know who's response is effective based off of the number of positive reactions they received.

At this point in time (yet again, and while I do understand the MRP gamemode is dying) I'd like to either re-work MilitaryRP so that it is better for everybody and hold a higher population, or shut it down for being a waste of a server slot. We are losing too much money running our Rust portion of the community to want to have a Gmod server hog a CPU core out of our main machine, when it could be better allocated elsewhere.

 

 

Here are some implications for some things players have brought up:

A.

Multiple people have made mentions about the "WEAPON SYSTEM SUCKING" but did not offer and revisions to it other than "REVERT IT BACK TO WHERE IT USED TO BE"- however, back then even more players complained of a "Sniper meta".

B.

I've heard "Omega isn't what you promised to deliver" but at the same time, when Omega was supposed to be the super close-quarter map that was originally planned, players asked me to create a tall/open skybox in favor of an airforce.

C.

Bringing back a 3-way or 4-way faction set-up would bring all the veterans back and re-boost population.

When we had 3 or 4 factions available, they were hardly ever managed properly, and we do not have enough influential leaders that'd be able to lead the addition of 2 more base-factions and 2 more sub-factions. If we had some solid veterans speak out and say "I will most definitely come back if we went back to CSCDesert in a 3/4-way faction setup, along with 4 other members to play Taliban" I would most definitely consider the idea. Otherwise, it seems to be all talk from people being nostalgic. More than likely when I/If I switch to CSCDesert, players would cry the map sucks and the playerbase isn't the same.

 

Looking forward to hear some input!

[BERB_DERE_GOTE 15]

Do something to buff the snipers. That's what most players associate Garnet with; And from what I've heard is the main reason for their playing the server; As well as their leaving. Certainly don't return it to the dominating meta it was; But give some credence to what seemingly made Garnet such a popular server. At least considering how much of the playerbase has left. I would personally increase all the SMG/Rifle accuracy to near perfect; However that's just my optimal experience.

Perhaps look into altering the map in some way also(inb4 compile time, It's 90% brushes) Mosque is impossible without Cons control; With RU already having less players, it's difficult to allocate players to taking it, let alone actual willingness to strategize.

Powerplant is just a very strange objective, but I'm alright with it as it normally has few players attempting to cap.

I would also recommend attempting to remedy the Arch camping problem. I'd recommend limiting visibility to the archways, as to prevent being sniped from halfway across the map. With the US arch to Shipment being the biggest offender.

Shipment is a well made objective in my opinion; Though I'd like for solid cover in the actual warehouse.

1 minute ago, BERB_DERE_GOTE said:

Do something to buff the snipers. That's what most players associate Garnet with; And from what I've heard is the main reason for their playing the server; As well as their leaving. Certainly don't return it to the dominating meta it was; But give some credence to what seemingly made Garnet such a popular server. At least considering how much of the playerbase has left. I would personally increase all the SMG/Rifle accuracy to near perfect; However that's just my optimal experience.

Perhaps look into altering the map in some way also(inb4 compile time, It's 90% brushes) Mosque is impossible without Cons control; With RU already having less players, it's difficult to allocate players to taking it, let alone actual willingness to strategize.

Powerplant is just a very strange objective, but I'm alright with it as it normally has few players attempting to cap.

I would also recommend attempting to remedy the Arch camping problem. I'd recommend limiting visibility to the archways, as to prevent being sniped from halfway across the map. With the US arch to Shipment being the biggest offender.

Shipment is a well made objective in my opinion; Though I'd like for solid cover in the actual warehouse.

I've just noticed that who I presume to be a gamemaster added a way to get over the fence blocking the RU entrance to Cons. Very positive change.

[Nutter 15,194]

4 minutes ago, BERB_DERE_GOTE said:

Do something to buff the snipers. That's what most players associate Garnet with; And from what I've heard is the main reason for their playing the server; As well as their leaving. Certainly don't return it to the dominating meta it was; But give some credence to what seemingly made Garnet such a popular server. At least considering how much of the playerbase has left. I would personally increase all the SMG/Rifle accuracy to near perfect; However that's just my optimal experience.

Out of general curiosity, what makes you personally think that it is the nerfing of the snipers which made some players leave?

As far as SMG/Rifle accuracy, making them near-perfect would make us identical to our competition at IFN, who have laser beams for weapons currently  

4 minutes ago, BERB_DERE_GOTE said:

Perhaps look into altering the map in some way also(inb4 compile time, It's 90% brushes) Mosque is impossible without Cons control; With RU already having less players, it's difficult to allocate players to taking it, let alone actual willingness to strategize.

I'm not entirely sure what to do as to separate Mosque from Cons, what I think i'll do it further space out the map and lower its render distance so you cannot see one objective from the other possibly

5 minutes ago, BERB_DERE_GOTE said:

I would also recommend attempting to remedy the Arch camping problem. I'd recommend limiting visibility to the archways, as to prevent being sniped from halfway across the map. With the US arch to Shipment being the biggest offender.

I will likely remove the arches in order to make the map fully open.

5 minutes ago, BERB_DERE_GOTE said:

 

Shipment is a well made objective in my opinion; Though I'd like for solid cover in the actual warehouse.

In what positions bud?

[Fetn 1,217]

Okay so coming off of my main ideas and stuff from what I have seen from playing. 

1. The snipers are actually somewhat decent still its just we cant fast fire anymore so we can't get huge fast feeds with snipers. But the movement speed with snipers I suggest making it 10% faster to help out for long range factions. 

2. Add a bit more cover to the map at power plant. The CQC aspect is still there but some times the long range aspect is overwhelming. Like I love how shipment is made for cqc like every time I play on that obj it is so fun since the base factions can still fight back against soc so its more even but RU side is lacking so much numbers and most the time we lose.
 

3.  the base factions are fine as is but I would maybe suggest shutting down some soc factions considering the numbers are being thinned down I don't really know but its just an idea. We don't have enough population to bring back 2 3 or even 4 factions available since all of them would be undermanned and everything.

4. Mosque is well for RU it is horrible if the US have snipers and soc. Construction has a hude line of sight on the entrance for RU and we can't do much there, but then when we try to flank we get gunned down by others I suggest adding cover for ru to cross into mosque safely but keeping it so your still somewhat vulnerable when crossing into mosque.

Overall thats all I really see as in problems with the server. I would hate to see mrp leaving but its been a good time while it was here. 

 

[BERB_DERE_GOTE 15]

4 minutes ago, Garnet said:

Out of general curiosity, what makes you personally think that it is the nerfing of the snipers which made some players leave?

Just what I've heard from players talking the following 1-2 days post nerf. I heard the complain exclusively about the snipers. I never saw those players again. As well as the fact that Garnet was in it's prime when the Sniper meta was at it's worst.

 

7 minutes ago, Garnet said:

In what positions bud?

The largest room with all of the shelves. I dislike being able to look through through the shelves but never being able too shoot through them effectively.

5 minutes ago, Fetn said:

4. Mosque is well for RU it is horrible if the US have snipers and soc. Construction has a hude line of sight on the entrance for RU and we can't do much there, but then when we try to flank we get gunned down by others I suggest adding cover for ru to cross into mosque safely but keeping it so your still somewhat vulnerable when crossing into mosque.

Biggest problem for the server RN. Accepting a Mosq/Cons war is suicide for RU.

[Fetn 1,217]

5 minutes ago, BERB_DERE_GOTE said:

Biggest problem for the server RN. Accepting a Mosq/Cons war is suicide for RU.

Yeah that is true I dislike the fact how it is but if garnet makes it so the render distance is lower it would be actually very fun to play mosque only wars and such. 

 

I dunno I have a good feeling that mrp can make a come back its happened before it'll take time the server can pop back up hella hella.

Edited January 21, 2021 by Fetn

[BERB_DERE_GOTE 15]

11 minutes ago, Garnet said:

As far as SMG/Rifle accuracy, making them near-perfect would make us identical to our competition at IFN, who have laser beams for weapons currently

I suppose that may be my CSGO monkey brain thinking I should be able to kill somebody from across the map if I'm good enough. Although anybody I've discussed this with say they would prefer significantly higher accuracy from SMG/Rifle; Granted that's only about 5-6 people. Though I suppose I'd understand if that's not the direction you wish to take.

[PraetorDon 485]

Preface by saying I don't play anymore, but I hang around and talk with people who do, as well as observing overall reactions/activity.

 

22 minutes ago, Garnet said:

A.

Multiple people have made mentions about the "WEAPON SYSTEM SUCKING" but did not offer and revisions to it other than "REVERT IT BACK TO WHERE IT USED TO BE"- however, back then even more players complained of a "Sniper meta".

 

 

Seems like a good start regarding snipers. Can't say I've play tested the new guns, but I heard the sniper changes in particular were a bit too much. 

 

23 minutes ago, Garnet said:

B.

I've heard "Omega isn't what you promised to deliver" but at the same time, when Omega was supposed to be the super close-quarter map that was originally planned, players asked me to create a tall/open skybox in favor of an airforce.

Most players at the time didn't care at all about Airforce/the higher skybox. What people were really excited about was the CQC based map. Not sure how true that holds today. While Omega wasn't my favorite map, it wasn't a bad map by any means. Could be time for another rotation.

 

25 minutes ago, Garnet said:

C.

Bringing back a 3-way or 4-way faction set-up would bring all the veterans back and re-boost population.

When we had 3 or 4 factions available, they were hardly ever managed properly, and we do not have enough influential leaders that'd be able to lead the addition of 2 more base-factions and 2 more sub-factions. If we had some solid veterans speak out and say "I will most definitely come back if we went back to CSCDesert in a 3/4-way faction setup, along with 4 other members to play Taliban" I would most definitely consider the idea. Otherwise, it seems to be all talk from people being nostalgic. More than likely when I/If I switch to CSCDesert, players would cry the map sucks and the playerbase isn't the same.

RU is fairly dead from my observation, I really don't think this would be in the server's best interests. 
 

 

Here's what I would do.

Time to Merge/Lock T2's again on both sides.

People with proven experience and staff go improve base + SOC. You don't need to lead a base/SOC for 3 months to make an impact. Set up the structure, get dedicated players, and then hand it off, with supervision. Likewise, if you're sitting in the same spot for over 2 months and doing the bare minimum, it's time to move on and let someone else get a chance at leading.

Leaders need to start enforcing TS usage, I've hopped on several times in the last few weeks and it's usually the same 8-10 people sitting in locked SOC channels. This will help build a sense of community some players won't get ingame.

Overall, adjust things a bit at a time regarding weapon/map balance. Sweeping changes aren't going to help much at this point. Prevents burnout too.

That's pretty much all I got right now. An MRP Official Discord, yeah I know, wouldn't be the worst idea either.

[AylmaoCS1 2]

In my opinion, as a previous MRP moderator and General back in the UK days, the biggest downfall I am noticing is inactive leaders. There are hardly ever tryouts which is what is ruining the game for me. The base classes are blatantly worse which is okay because it encourages you to go to tryouts and get better classes when you join an elite subfaction, but with pretty much all of the leadership of those subfactions being gone you have no way to tryout, which gives you nothing to look forward to. We've seen in the past where people just let their friends and people they like join which causes factions to die out when they all get bored (for example back when Navy just started under Jester). The only options I see for this is to revert back to one subfaction per faction, or remove them completely and just have better classes on the base faction to tryout for. 

Another opinion of mine with a little less basis is to limit the amount of snipers a server can have on even further, I think this will make a lot of people mad but also create a better experience for new players, I believe this because a good sniper can easily control an entire path to an objective, and with so many, it makes it hard for people without them to even get on objectives and have more close action battles like they're supposed to be in with their weaponry. 

 

These are just my honest opinions from my experiences so don't bash me edgelords.

[huskaii 586]

Before weapon/hud changes we had good numbers

after all these changes, player count drops to new lows

notice anything? it could just be a coincidence, but lots of players simply dont like the changes and would rather just go back to how it was like a month ago before the updates. Just a thought

[Foxxx 17]

8 minutes ago, huskaii said:

Before weapon/hud changes we had good numbers

after all these changes, player count drops to new lows

notice anything? it could just be a coincidence, but lots of players simply dont like the changes and would rather just go back to how it was like a month ago before the updates. Just a thought

Before update we were getting 100 player pops then after update we got 100 players 1 time and went down from there.

[Kendal 450]

Maybe it's time to hit a reset of some sort? Maybe drastic measures should be taken now? If it is 1 last attempt for MRP truly, then maybe some risks should be taken here. Hopefully players can see that in resetting some things, they could be giving their faction or "power" up, but overall it would be better for the community as a whole. And again, I HOPE that players can see THAT's what I'd like to accomplish, rather than just stripping everyone just because LOL.

One thing we need is a strong centralized command within each respective side. Currently 11B GEN and 2GA Marshal are in charge of army and 2GA. That's all. Leadership within 2GA and 11B don't seem to be respected since "it's a base faction". This thought process needs to change. Let's use 2GA as an example. The Marshal is the only RU leader that should hold significant stature over the other leaders, and should be giving orders to the other factions. This means that, the Marshal and his closest higher ranking officers should oversee that RU as a whole is running well, not just 2GA. The Marshal should be coordinating with the other factions, creating war plans, creating small RP based events where they'd designate who goes where and what role each participating faction would have, etc. The Marshal should be overseeing the appointment of leaders for the other factions, and should essentially be in charge of what happens on RU at large, with all of the other leaders having some say in what gets done. Currently the Marshal of 2GA is someone who is basically going to be laughed at and ridiculed when they have any criticism to other leaders. Comments like "Lol u lead a base faction" would be very easy to laugh off if the Marshal actually held any significant weight with his rank.

Im not saying a 12 year old should be able to tell everyone what to do with impunity however. In my mind the 2GA Marshal/11B General ranks should be held by staff members who can coordinate with each other to set up dope ass country wide events, they can reasonably assess problems within their countries respectively and solve them. However currently, at the end of the day each side lacks strong leadership that can actually take charge and get shit done. So giving the o-11's some sway over the o-6 leaders could actually have meaningful impact. I think that leaders for 2GA and 11B should be decided based on Merit, based on who is next in line. I think that they should also have to put an application in on the forums or something so the community as a whole has some say in whether or not they can do the job. 

One funny thing I notice currently is that all SOC factions have retard filters to see who can follow orders, however the leaders making those retard filters don't have to follow orders in their mind since... Who is going to stop them? 

The abilities of the o-11's should include:

-Overseeing transitions of power within other branches of their faction. Being sure that the next person who leads a branch will be able to follow orders, coordinate, and run a smooth and respectable branch within the faction.

-Making sure officers in the base factions are running a tight ship and pulling their weight with their rank instead of doing the bare minimum (aka the QUOTA). This means that the Marshal / General do NOT need to micromanage every little thing that happens all the time, and make all decisions themselves. 

-The ability to coordinate with and setup RP events with the enemy o-11 (or officers if one of them isn't on) in order to show that NOT EVERY EVENT NEEDS TO BE RAN BY STAFF. There is PLENTY to do within the map during Peacetime, so just utilizing peacetime for tryouts or sims is just plain fucking stupid.

-They should be able to give (reasonable) orders to the other factions, and expect them to be done. For example, if the General tells Rangers to go and hold Mosque, yet there's a random ranger sniping at shipment then the General should be able to reprimand that behavior. This in large part falls into the category of "The other branch leaders don't give a fuck about what the o-11 has to say"

I have more to say on this, so I will be editing and adding on to this response later, I'm not done here.

[Nutter 15,194]

2 hours ago, Fetn said:

1. The snipers are actually somewhat decent still its just we cant fast fire anymore so we can't get huge fast feeds with snipers. But the movement speed with snipers I suggest making it 10% faster to help out for long range factions. 

I would most definitely be open to increasing the mobility speed of snipers, I figured they'd just switch to a different weapon when need to run around.

2 hours ago, Fetn said:

2. Add a bit more cover to the map at power plant. The CQC aspect is still there but some times the long range aspect is overwhelming. Like I love how shipment is made for cqc like every time I play on that obj it is so fun since the base factions can still fight back against soc so its more even but RU side is lacking so much numbers and most the time we lose.

Would really need better reference to where you'd like to see more cover

2 hours ago, BERB_DERE_GOTE said:

Just what I've heard from players talking the following 1-2 days post nerf. I heard the complain exclusively about the snipers. I never saw those players again. As well as the fact that Garnet was in it's prime when the Sniper meta was at it's worst.

No doubt sniper meta at its worst was some of our best times on the server, but it seems that all the players were whining that they're not even enjoying the server then, weird balance.

1 hour ago, BERB_DERE_GOTE said:

Although anybody I've discussed this with say they would prefer significantly higher accuracy from SMG/Rifle; Granted that's only about 5-6 people. Though I suppose I'd understand if that's not the direction you wish to take.

Well, they currently do have near pinpoint accuracy, are you referring to their recoil?

1 hour ago, PraetorDon said:

Most players at the time didn't care at all about Airforce/the higher skybox. What people were really excited about was the CQC based map. Not sure how true that holds today. While Omega wasn't my favorite map, it wasn't a bad map by any means. Could be time for another rotation.

It might be time for a rotation, yeah, as far as the map, you were part of my streams and should've seen people's reactions though lol. Most if not everybody was in favor of AFSOC. Doesn't say alot since Jake was there 24/7.

1 hour ago, PraetorDon said:

Time to Merge/Lock T2's again on both sides.

People with proven experience and staff go improve base + SOC. You don't need to lead a base/SOC for 3 months to make an impact. Set up the structure, get dedicated players, and then hand it off, with supervision. Likewise, if you're sitting in the same spot for over 2 months and doing the bare minimum, it's time to move on and let someone else get a chance at leading.

Leaders need to start enforcing TS usage, I've hopped on several times in the last few weeks and it's usually the same 8-10 people sitting in locked SOC channels. This will help build a sense of community some players won't get ingame.

Overall, adjust things a bit at a time regarding weapon/map balance. Sweeping changes aren't going to help much at this point. Prevents burnout too.

That's pretty much all I got right now. An MRP Official Discord, yeah I know, wouldn't be the worst idea either.

All pretty strong points, I've been wanting to reduce our number of factions, as well as encourage TS usage, but it doesn't seem as though Jake holds enough influence to persuasde people to utilize TS, leading me to actually thinking about making a MRP-exclusive Discord, so I may just do that now  

43 minutes ago, huskaii said:

Before weapon/hud changes we had good numbers

after all these changes, player count drops to new lows

notice anything? it could just be a coincidence, but lots of players simply dont like the changes and would rather just go back to how it was like a month ago before the updates. Just a thought

Yeah, I notice that you didn't collect your data correctly, and you have a couple more people agreeing with you who also didn't collect data/fact check, leading to a pointles/unhelpful post.

Prior to the update we had 3 of our worst days, consecutively. Hitting 38, 31, and 32 at peak (we had ONE singular day in-between of hitting 90 or so). The day of the update Our population spiked up to 100, and dwindled every since, albeit at a much better spot than before the update. So yes, I noticed something lol.

33 minutes ago, Foxxx said:

Before update we were getting 100 player pops then after update we got 100 players 1 time and went down from there.

Suggest fact checking.

[Pencil 767]

Honestly I really agree with @Kendal's post. Though I think limiting SOC factions at the moment could do some good.

Have an O-11 that oversees each side and is a respected figure, not a meme. Have General ranks look over SOC branches and actually have things to delegate instead of just being a high up LT. It's really sad to see someone with the rank of General have a squeaky ass voice and spam music out of a 12 dollar microphone. Again, yes its gmod but there should be a standard for that rank.

So what would this look like? Well lets say we get rid of MARSOC and SEALs.
O-11 oversees ALL army branches, including Rangers and Green Beret, and regular 11B. O-10 is his second in command and fills his role when he is not present. O-7 to O-9 will mainly handle inter-faction relations between the army branches and duties given by the O-10 or O-11.
Heavily expand upon faction classes to where they have 6 FREE whitelists (with 3 donor tier ones). Each preferably with different models and unique gear sets.

Why this? Well it solves the issue of inactivity among leaders, if we merge current numbers into each faction then we in theory double the officer count and the chance for activity. When it gets to the point of having too many people in one faction, simply add battalions to said faction. Just a thought.

2 hours ago, Garnet said:

"WEAPON SYSTEM SUCKING"

Honestly there has been worse. Notable things that are issues rn are Donator SMGs really don't have a place except for maybe FMG( I think it was untouched lol) AR's are kind of outshined by AEK, ironic since its donor and meant to be worse. Statistically it just has better stats than other ARs. I know you might say, nono it has less damage and what not. But no, if a gun has 34-49 damage its gonna be a three shot, no matter what. This makes a gun like the honey badger, which has 47 damage but 57% recoil and 20 less firerate than the AEK not viable at all. I obviously can't speak for all ARs since I am not in every faction but I assume they share similar issues.

To add on to SMGs, some pistol stats are better than SMGs right now. I think the FMG-9 should be used as a model for SMGs, and have a variation between Fast firing SMGs with 1200 firerate( or 1350 like old SEAL mp5), but longer reload time, and can't 4 shot with suppressor, and 1091firerate(or what the FMG is) and moderate reload time.

Sniper changes have been listed in my suggestion, I spoke to lots of people in the community before making the post and I think it appeals to most of the people that have left.

Map wise I am actually enjoying Omega, main flaws I see are Powerpoint being a kind of so-so objective(it just has really 'meh' gameplay, I'll go into more detail if needed). Mosque, Shipment and Cons play perfectly into one another and all feel really nice. It's just a struggle for when one side cannot afford to send people to Cons due to numbers that issues arise. (Maybe give Head GMs the ability to spawn in the fog cube to increase fog during low pop wars?) And the last issue I really notice is the arches, most of them have really long sight lines to them which is problematic for basecamping.

[Kendal 450]

43 minutes ago, Pencil said:

 So what would this look like? Well lets say we get rid of MARSOC and SEALs.
O-11 oversees ALL army branches, including Rangers and Green Beret, and regular 11B. O-10 is his second in command and fills his role when he is not present. O-7 to O-9 will mainly handle inter-faction relations between the army branches and duties given by the O-10 or O-11.
Heavily expand upon faction classes to where they have 6 FREE whitelists (with 3 donor tier ones). Each preferably with different models and unique gear sets. 

I actually spoke to garnet on potentially utilizing more of the Playermodels, weapons, etc in order to have way more variety without the need for as many factions. iirc the reason he is iffy on that is the amount of rebalancing for weapons he'd have to do, as well as potential player model fixes (wonky hit boxes, assigning a WL to a specific faction, etc). I don't blame him considering it seems like a nightmare to introduce anything new to gmod servers in general.

 

What could be pretty beneficial would be merging/removing the branches that don't make sense to even be here (PDSS, Seals, Marsoc). When I say that I mean like, neither faction has a navy, so why do we have PDSS and seals? US doesn't have 1MD anymore, why does it have MARSOC. 

After removing those, maybe we could see something like battalions in 11B with their own respective leaders and strengths (capped at like o-4 or something). And vice versa with 2GA. These are just ideas, and would definitely need to be expanded upon.

Overall though, people say there isn't proper leadership, and then ignore what the marshal/General tell them to do.

On that note, when you really take a look at the magnum dong of a map we have here, and the amount of things that could be done with factions (even base), you see that there's actually a ton of directions we could go in. Sure the weapons and stuff are controversial issues rn to some people, but there are things WE could do, that don't require garnet to code or map. 

Battalions in 11B and 2GA could be a thing, they could be engaging for players as they join the server and they think "oh shit where do I want to be?". Giving officers leadership of small battalions could also keep officers active and engaged.

Operations, Intelligence briefings, Actual kidnap interrogations for reliable intel, these could all be dope ass things. But so much of the playerbase is trapped in this old archaic way of thinking. Thinking that factions should be how they were last year, when the server is struggling because of how things were last year. Thinking that RP is a cringefest of "/me bends over and ties shoes" when it can actually be something fun and engaging for a player to be a part of. 

Its a fucking shame. We could genuinely have so much fun in a sandbox MRP, but we're all too caught up in attacking each other, or shitting on good ideas that people you don't like came up with. If what happened to Ozzy proves anything, its that this community can be its own worst enemy a lot of the time. And it fucking sucks.

Edited January 21, 2021 by Kendal