New Rule - Stopping retarded tryouts

[Catfisher 112]

3 minutes ago, Tayler said:

A) Force them to leave their current held rank in any SOC faction or wherever they're currently located

Trial stage is the time for them to decide what they want to dedicate themselves to. There's no point in making people feel rushed in their dedication, therefore making them less sure in what they want to join. Giving them a longer period of time lets them make a better decision.

4 minutes ago, Tayler said:

B) Make tryouts not easy, but not stupid like making them wait days to recieve a whitelist. This one is kind of self explanatory, no?

Tryouts can still be difficult but still have people pass them without being mature/dedicated enough. Trial stage tests that after the tryout.

[Tayler 395]

Just now, Jasmin | Garnetgaming.net said:

Here is also a point to, someone could easily be really good at passing the tryouts but that user could also be so damn retarded and be very disrespectful and give the faction a bad rep to the server. I sorry dude but my -1 still stands no matter how much points you can make.

I'm not asking you for your +1 nor am I making an effort for you to do so. I'm simply stating that your points are just really bad can be countered by 

A) Not letting that person in if they're a douche?

B) Removing them if they're a douche? 

C) Getting over reputation because it doesn't matter? Which I can say is easy because SEALs.

[Tayler 395]

Just now, Catfisher said:

Trial stage is the time for them to decide what they want to dedicate themselves to. There's no point in making people feel rushed in their dedication, therefore making them less sure in what they want to join. Giving them a longer period of time lets them make a better decision.

Tryouts can still be difficult but still have people pass them without being mature/dedicated enough. Trial stage tests that after the tryout.

1. Why the hell are you trying out if you're not sure of dedication? That isn't something that a trial stage is going to help with. You're kind of thick in the head if you're going to tryout for a faction then need to reconsider your decision over 4 days.

2. Okay, then remove that person and or aid them to not be a cuck? Again, something a trial period is not needed for. If you're going to tell me a new player is going to destroy your factions reputation, then it's more than likely you already have a bad reputation, because if people know how your faction runs they'll understand it's not a big deal.

[Catfisher 112]

3 minutes ago, Tayler said:

1. Why the hell are you trying out if you're not sure of dedication? That isn't something that a trial stage is going to help with. You're kind of thick in the head if you're going to tryout for a faction then need to reconsider your decision over 4 days.

2. Okay, then remove that person and or aid them to not be a cuck? Again, something a trial period is not needed for. If you're going to tell me a new player is going to destroy your factions reputation, then it's more than likely you already have a bad reputation, because if people know how your faction runs they'll understand it's not a big deal.

Honestly, you can argue both sides of this story forever. In my opinion, all a Trial Stage is just a period of time to make decisions for all sides. For the person who passed, it's their chance to figure our whether or not they want to stay, figure out if they need to step up a level in maturity, figure out what their goals are, etc. For the leader of the Faction, it's their chance to evaluate the trainee in their maturity, skill level (which the tryouts already did, but more doesn't hurt), and their dedication. I strongly believe that more time means a better decision. Thanks for arguing this, lots of good points and it opened my eyes more on the subject.

Edited September 14, 2018 by Catfisher

[Jasmin 174]

Just now, Catfisher said:

Honestly, you can argue both sides of this story forever. In my opinion, all a Trial Stage is just a period of time to make decisions for all sides. For the person who passed, it's their chance to figure our whether or not they want to stay, figure out if they need to step up a level in maturity, figure out what their goals are, etc. For the leader of the Faction, it's their chance to evaluate the trainee in their maturity, skill level (which the tryouts already did, but more doesn't hurt), and their dedication. I strongly believe that more time means a better decision. Thanks for arguing this, lots of good points and it opened my eyes more on the subject.

Amen.

[PrisonNightmare 741]

15 minutes ago, Tayler said:

This is the last thing to use this argument on. I lead a faction and I know how annoying it can be when people try and tell you how to run it, but again, this is something that SHOULDN'T be happening.

It does seem fucked up about how the SSO does it, but I can understand why they do it. Again, I'm not fully knowledgeable on these SOC tryouts I'm just replying to what I've seen in this thread.

15 minutes ago, Tayler said:

Does it not sound abnoxish to you that you're waiting 4 days to get a whitelist on the server? Why do tryouts if you're not really getting or being apart of what you passed?

Do they say that you passed the tryout but they make you wait four days before they give this person a whitelist or is this TRN period apart of their tryouts? They are eventually going to get the whitelist, correct? I really just don't see the problem here, if someone isn't dedicated enough to wait 3-4 days then they obviously aren't going to be dedicated enough to stay in the faction. If someone doesn't agree with how the leader is running their tryouts, then they shouldn't be in the faction. Simple as that.

 

Point is, it depends on how this leader does their evaluation period/TRN period. I don't think outright banning this is the correct solution, all your doing is limiting the period the host can evaluate their trainee.

[Tayler 395]

2 minutes ago, PrisonNightmare said:

Point is, it depends on how this leader does their evaluation period/TRN period. I don't think outright banning this is the correct solution, all your doing is limiting the period the host can evaluate their trainee.

But it's not limiting the evaluation time because the evaluation time can be X long. How would it make it shorter or longer if you just gave them the whitelist and did the same thing, but with the whitelist? I see your point, and I understand it's kind of nitpick thing to bitch about, but I find it really weird how tryouts have come as far as this. I guess I'm just not seeing the benefit or amazing special tactics this is providing? But whatever happens be it. A suggestion is a suggestion and I'm not going to be suprised to those who do and don't +1/-1. Point is, you're wasting people's time by making them aim for something that they're not getting until they "prove themselves" days later. 

[Futureocean2 3]

Once You Go though on of the SOC's hard tryouts and fail, then you try time after time. You finally will pass and once you do they hold you off and tell you to go through a trial stage? I Don't like the aspect of that So I am going to +1

[Dowsy 36]

+1

I mean I would understand if the trial happened with the whitelist (you know to see if your good etc). But without the whitelist... that honestly just sounds stupid.

 

Edited September 14, 2018 by Upland

[Ethan 457]

-1

The way I have designed my faction to run in terms of the tryouts is to test their skill, and ability, as well as a basic level of competence inside of the tryouts. Then afterwards, give them a trial stage where they hang out with the faction's members, see what the faction is about from the inside, learn the ropes of how we operate in war as it isn't the same (as a base faction of course), so I can see how mature they are in many ways (a part of this is me asking other faction Officers/leaders/members about anything they may have seen negative or positive about the trial stage Soldier, and to test their patience (their ability to earn things). People who join the faction for the weapons alone are joining for the wrong reason. This trial stage allows me to check on their availability, and how willing they are to play in the faction. Of course, some things fly out of the blue that no one can expect, but this allows that to happen less often where people drop out of the faction for another after a few days of having the whitelist.

If they can't wait 4 days for me to make sure they are ready, and have earned one of my whitelists, I don't want them in my faction.

Now sure, you can do this by giving them the whitelist and test them on this trial period, but I believe that the whitelist of a faction is something that should be given with precision, when earned, and for SSO, I don't want pure skill to be the faction's main function. Other factions do that plenty well, and I want people who play the game in a similar mind set as myself to be in my faction.

It is a different perspective, and way of running things. The main issues you brought up here are not anything major whatsoever. This whole argument is one built on opinion, and feeling more than any actual problems. The only issue that I saw that may be a good argument is the numbers of the faction. SSO is fine in numbers, we have 12 members, a healthy number for a special forces faction. When Russia talks about numbers, they mean GRU not existing as it had 2 non-reserved members at one point in time. You seem to agree with the premise of checking on them, and making sure they are ready, and your only concern is the whitelist, unless I misunderstood you. The only thing I can say to that is it is a difference in value. You seem to hold the value of a whitelist a lot lower than me and some others do. If this really does create issues, I haven't seen them yet, and I will be glad to better the functioning of the server if it does become an issue.

TL;DR

It isn't a waste of time as it is valuable time used for good reasons being evaluation of maturity, and giving them a feeling for the faction and it's members before fully joining as the members of a faction and the leader are the main makers of the faction itself in deciding if you enjoy your time in it or not. The congratulations is you have passed the tryouts, and are now beginning your journey into the faction. The only difference between this and what you are suggesting is taking more time with the earning of the whitelist, which is a completely opinionated issue based on what you think the value of being whitelisted/passing a tryout is. The argument that has some stats/facts behind it being numbers, but SSO is doing fine in numbers, with a current healthy 12 members total.

This is a topic I have thought out for a while, and got many opinions on before implementing, and have refined and tuned ever since it's implementation, so I had a good amount to say. If you actually read it all, thank you for doing so, and I hope you understand my point behind it. The only things that should be on the rules are things that effect the well-being of the server, not how a faction itself runs to keep the members engaged and happy.

[Arizona 169]

-1. Just because you can pass a tryout does not mean you are ready for a faction. As Ethan beautifully stated before, its not a waste of time. If you consider it a waste, or something you cannot do because you believe it belittles you, don't join that SOC. CDT or TRN periods are to evaluate a player, to make sure not only they are good, but that they can obey simple orders and not act like a dumbass.

[Texas 171]

-1 Sure this was said but some factions want to make sure that they wont have a minge in there faction. Take SSO for example. Think it is a good thing.

[Lex_ 506]

7 hours ago, Tayler said:

Any person(s) to pass a tryout MUST recieve the whitelist on completition unless said person is unable to whitelist or there is no staff online. Furthermore, "trial period" ranks are not allowed and players must be evaluated as an ACTUAL player of the faction if said faction chooses to do evals.

I do agree that this waiting period and not getting a whitelist instantly after finishing a tryout is unnecessary except for a trial period with individual evals and whitelist. The first one is not at all needed and there are better ways of solving the issues that it brings up. The second way is useful as an officer to pick and choose which of those who passed are well-mannered enough to be in your faction, or it could even be about their amount of activity. You make a very bad impression when you try out for a faction once, pass first time, take the whitelist, and then don't show up for the next week without announcing anything. That tryout was a waste of time and was even worse after expecting a new active member. 

[Phantom 1,548]

I'm not going to make a rule stating what you can or can't do for a tryout. So far, there have been no complaints about the system besides yours and the players in SSO don't seem to mind it. Personally, I don't see a point in not giving the whitelist, but it is not a major issue right now.

[Nutter 15,197]

Rifleman is essentially the 'trial period' class, because it has a typical assault rifle like every other faction has for their entry. Really failing to understand why Tayler is getting -1s.